Wednesday, July 19, 2006
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Yesterday I posted about Paul Sheriff’s new subscription-based online venture. It is an experiment on Paul’s part, and it is something he’s put a huge amount of time and effort into building.

 

Interestingly, there’s been a bit of pushback – at least in the comments on my blog – to Paul charging for his site. Of course this is an experiment, and so only time will tell if Paul’s investment in time and money putting it together, and his ongoing investment in building content will actually pay off.

 

But I hope it does work, and this is why.

 

It has been clear for a while now that the world is undergoing some major changes. While the Internet didn't transform the world like all the dot-com nuts thought it would, it really is having a non-trivial (if ponderous) impact as time goes by.

 

(for a thought-provoking view of a possible future, check out Epic 2014).

 

A few of us, Paul and myself included, are trying to figure out how to adapt to this new world. With book sales radically down and magazine subscriptions failing and technical conferences struggling, it is becoming less and less practical for a professional author/speaker to make a living.

 

Now it might be the case that free content will have the same quality as professionally created, reviewed and edited content. But I doubt it. Some people can generate quality content without reviewers and editors, but most can’t. And in any case there’s no substitute for experience. As with anything, experience has tremendous value. If you look at any professional author’s work you’ll see a progression as they get better and better at explaining their ideas over time.

 

Not that there isn't some great free content out there, but wading through all the random content to find it is very expensive. There’s no doubt that some people invest their time and effort in improving their writing skills for free, but over time it is hard to commit to that level of focus without some level of compensation.

 

I specifically avoided saying that some people do this as a hobby. Because I think that is very rare. People write to get compensation. In many cases it is financial – either directly, because they get paid to write, or indirectly, because they expect to get a raise, or to more easily job-hop into a raise.

 

Coming back to that sifting through the web thing though… Time isn't free. In fact I'm of the opinion that time is far more valuable than money for most of the people in our profession. Wasting hours sifting through random outdated, or just plain poor, content to find that one gem on someone's blog is really costly.

 

For some people it is worth that time, for others it is not. There's no way to pass a global value judgment on this, because different people have different jobs and priorities. If I can spend a couple hours writing code, I'm much happier than if I spent a couple hours reading random web content. Other people love reading and sifting through random web content and don't begrudge that time in the slightest.

 

One thing that I always keep in mind though, is that we (in the US and Europe anyway) cost 4-7 times more than people in India or China. That means we need to be 4-7 times more productive to justify our existence. So that time spent sifting through the web needs to result in some pretty impressive productivity or it was just a very high cost.

 

I sift through the web at least as much as the next guy, don’t get me wrong. But not really by choice. If some web-sifter out there started a subscription-based index into content that is actually up to date and valid I’d pay for it. Google is great, but just think if there was a Google that only searched meaningful content!?! I don’t care about the vast majority of what people put on the web, there are just a few gems I’m looking for.

 

Unfortunately, thus far the idea of a paid index for content hasn’t proven to be a viable business model. And the web is undermining traditional forms of providing content. So the world is changing.

 

But I don’t believe for a minute that the value of professional content is lower than in the past, I just think the delivery of that content is in flux.

 

So the question then, is how to deliver professional content in this new world? And in a way where the producers, reviewers and editors of the content are compensated for their effort. Time isn’t free, not for you as the reader, nor for those of us engaged in professionally producing that content.

 

We’ll all find out whether Paul’s experiment works or not over time. But he’s not alone in looking for ways to adapt to this new world, and you can expect to see some experiments from other people as well – including me – in the relatively near future.


Wednesday, July 19, 2006 7:18:22 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Hey man, I can't say I disagree. Writing books is worth less than minimum wage, even if your book does well :).

The reason for that is probably lower sales, but also the measly royality cuts we get. And this isn't about a specific publisher - it's all of 'em.

As a result, most newer books produced these days are rushed up, because it simply isn't worth the time anymore.

I hope Paul succeeds, and if he does, then it will make sense for other authors to produce compelling paid content that is actually worth spending time on.

Hey and not like I'm talking of something that hasn't been done before. People do that in the finance sector all the time. And heard of forrester? Well how do they make money?

Go Paul !!
Wednesday, July 19, 2006 7:39:11 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
You're absolutely right. There is change and it's going to eventually be pretty complete. (Not as fast as some people seemed to genuinely expect.) One of the bad things now is that compared to the early adopters we've now got some other parts of society who are simply nasty and a genuine barrier to progress.

Be that as it may there are couple of trends:

1) When somebody discovers a new thing like this they can get very enthusiastic. Put in hours of work and it can be very productive. (I'd argue that in many cases much more productive than even top grade 9 to 5 productivity.) Trouble is boredom sets in (sometimes that takes a few years, sometimes months) and without additional motivation it all stops.

2) There have been several waves and continue to be several distinct ways of looking at the web. Pure source editing, print derived tools (anti-programmer), do everything absolutely everything with CSS, code via a complex infrastructure (i.e. aspx), blog, coming soon Avalon... Some of these communities have erected silos and climbed inside (isolation), if we're lucky we'll eventually get more broadly educated people who grok the essence of most approaches. Then we can have polymaths say both selling their art on-line AND writing code that can be admired.

There will I think end up being a lot of niches, more than we had in the old brick and mortar world, but there'll be a lot of pain finding them.

On Paul's site I found that I couldn't get enough of a sampler to tell whether it makes sense for me. Things that made me wary were I suspect that his lessons are for groups that don't relate and the way he slices the levels of participation looks a bit alien. But good luck to him.

(I got the page back with another puzzle, hope this isn't a repost.)
Wednesday, July 19, 2006 9:28:47 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Personally, I've never had an issue using Google to find information on issues I'm running into. When you say, "Wasting hours sifting through random outdated, or just plain poor, content to find that one gem on someone's blog is really costly", I did a double-take. It REALLY takes hours to find information on the Internet?

I don't think Paul's method is going to succeed, but I could be wrong. I just don't see a reason to shell out the bucks to subscribe to his site. YMMV. However, I do agree that good writers should get compensation for their output. How information and content and compensation pans out in the future...hell, I have no idea, and experimentation is needed.
Wednesday, July 19, 2006 10:07:01 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
It doesn't take hours to find everything, but try finding content on WPF (as an example). I think this heralds the beginning of the end of google being useful. WPF has had so many releases, and has changed so much, and has been SO extensively covered by blogs and other sources, that the odds of finding any current or useful WPF info through google is (in my experience thus far) at least 10:1 against.

It isn't the hours of reading - it is the trying the tidbit from site X only to find it is 6 months old, then rewriting your code according to site Y, but finding out it is 5 months old, etc. By the time you finally get to site Z42 that has the current tidbit, you're burned out...
Wednesday, July 19, 2006 11:50:29 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I think the pushback is more related to the attitude of Paul's site and not the fact that he is charging for services.
ps
Thursday, July 20, 2006 6:23:26 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
But your example uses a tool/product that is still in beta! You can't expect WPF-related material on the net to be accurate and insightful. Give it time - it'll catch up. I disagree that "this heralds the beginning of the end of google being useful" - quite the opposite, IMO.

I've never been burned out finding material via Googling. Googling has been a life-saver for me on many a project as I've tried to figure out how things work. I really don't see that disappearing any time soon.

ps did bring up a good point too that Paul's attitude on his site might be what annoys people. To me, it feels a little elitist, and that did turn me off to it.
Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:02:13 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
True, but what are the odds that the dozens of blog authors are going to go back and delete all their old WPF posts when WPF comes out?

Certainly over time (after WPF is released) there'll be more and more valid content, and eventually the outdated stuff will become the minority - but it will still be there, and still be indexed, and still show up in search engines.

The problem is compounded by the recent trend by vendors (especially Microsoft) to be more "open" and to do regular alpha/beta releases of their products, often every couple months, for a long period of time before release. This, coupled with the blogsphere, leads to the indexing engines becoming full of old stuff.

Yes, eventually the old stuff will flush itself out - but we don't know how long that'll take. WPF is really the first major many-pre-release product to come out with the blogsphere in full swing. My guess is that it will take many months, if not over a year, for valid content to flush out the old stuff.

So during the first year of a release, when it is most critical for most people to get quality content, they'll be sifting through google, finding more old than new - and not being able to differentiate without trying and finding that the blog content is useless.

Having just updated my site to use CSS (which is not new, nor beta), I can tell you that I spent untold hours sifting through a lot of really shitty content on the web. The only way I found a couple good sites is thanks to comments on MY blog - google never did point me to the sites that had the great content...
Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:43:56 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Probably little to none. I don't go back to my old posts and change content when dependent tools change. But I don't see what paid content will do to change that, and frankly, if there's no searching to at least KNOW that paid content may contain the answer, who cares? That's another big problem I see with paid content - you can't search it. At least, not right now, so why would I want to plunk down $$$ in the hopes that someone MAY have the answer in their resources?

Are Google searches always efficient? Of course not. I did some CSS work over the past year and yes, trying to find the good web sites with good CSS content took some time, but it wasn't hours either.

I'm not advocating an "answer" to this. But frankly, googling has been a viable solution for me (and many others) for years, and I don't see the need to fork over $$$ to every "inner circle" that pops up. Thanks, but no thanks.
Thursday, July 20, 2006 11:17:00 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I don't deny the value of google, nor am I over-eager to pay to get content.

But that worries me, because there's a truism: you get what you pay for.

Collectively, on the web and on TV, people are choosing to pay for less and less. In the case of TV the result is reality TV, because it is the only thing that can be produced cheaply enough to work when more and more people Tivo past all the commercials.

On the web, in our industry, it means that magazines, book publishers (and thus authors) and speakers have fewer and fewer venues where there's any profit. It could be the case that we're looking at a future where the only content available is produced by vendors (Microsoft will fund books for their purposes) and by individuals willing to donate their time for free, in the hopes of getting that promotion or being able to job-hop.

And maybe that's OK - I don't know. For me it is not OK, because I'm sure I wouldn't write as much if I did it for free. I'd rather spend that time with my kids. But objectively maybe even that is OK - would it really matter if all the established authors/speakers faded away?

Some have already - Don Box, Chris Sells and others adapted to this new world order by joining a vendor. What speaking and writing they do is in the service of their employer, not themselves, and that's probably OK too. Thus far I've personally resisted following that path, because I prefer to retain a relatively independent voice. I can still say that I prefer log4net, and feel good about it :)

Others have adapted by moving up the food chain. Neither business people nor IT management google like we do, and there's money to be made in talking with pictures - focusing on architectural concepts and avoiding code. In fact there's a lot MORE money there because those are the people with the checkbook. Again, I've personally resisted following that path, because I love the technology. Sure, I like fluffy architecture, concept and theory - but only if I can apply it too...

Maybe I want the impossible - to make a living writing and speaking about technology. Certainly this has been possible for a long time, but it may be that the developer community will decide that, as a collective, there's no sense paying for such a service when people will do it as a sideline for free. And who can argue against that?

If I could get quality TV without paying for it I'd love it. But I'm part of a group that makes amateur movies, and I can tell you that you get what you pay for. While we have fun, our stuff is pretty sketchy... And reality TV is a total waste of time - oy!

So I _do_ get my TV, but I pay for it - buying DVD collections of the shows that I actually care about.

I just hope that enough developers have a similar perspective, and are willing to pay for professional content through some venue. Since magazines and books aren't the venue, the question remains: what is? Or should we all just join a vendor or move into fluffy architecture-land?
Thursday, July 20, 2006 2:12:38 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Had to enter code twice, hope this isn't a repost.

The whole idea is pompous. I think there are too many people in this world that love developing software for the joy of it rather than the pay to see this ever come to fruition, at least I hope so.

You know it's amazing that he speaks of all of this commitment and enthusiasm and it's not for a 9 to 5'er...but the majority of people he will get will probably be 9 to 5'ers...why? Because they're lazy people who want the answers spoon fed to them.

Great developers didn't become great developers because of the money made in the industry, at least the ones I look up to, they became great developers because they live and breathe this stuff and would be great if things were spoon fed to them. Buying information would be the equivelant of saying 'yeah, it's a job, but I don't want to have to work for it'.

Closing the doors and asking these outragous fees (and they are outrageous) is telling the young men and woman in our industry that we are money driven, and if you don't make enough to pay the fees then you can't be in our club. That's a rich pompous attitude to me. And I've always run circles around developers who are just in it for the money - why? Because they have no passion.

I grew up poor and scratched and clawed my way to my decently paying position because I'm passionate about what I do for a living; I'm passionate about software. I contribute freely and eagerly at our local .NET users group and several message boards and don't regret not getting a penny for it because I love what I do. There's an old proverb that says a man who loves his job never works a day in his life. I haven't worked for a number of years now. And yes there is a lot of bad coders out there, but I am not perfect, and they're not perfect; and most like myself will take constructive critism and grow from it. We all got to start somewhere.

The day I become so arrogant and pompous that I start expecting, or even dare thinking, that I'm so darn good that people should pay me to share my knowledge with them (unless I'm in a formal teaching position) or that I'm too good to sit down with someone and in a constructive way point out their mistakes and help them become a better programmer is the day it's time for me to look for a career change.

To put it another way, if I had this type of attitude I would of never served in the Army for six years standing up for the rights of our people and our belief's in coutries overseas, including the middle east, because I was only paid 12K a year when I first started. We'd probably have no military at all and just have a militia of paid mercenaries if that was the case of all Americans.

So if those of you who are at the top want to close the gates and build walls, go right ahead; that will make it all the easier for me to retire your butts when I become as good as you, on my own, and share the knowledge, to those who want to learn, for free. Because there is a large group of us out here who have worked our way up the ranks, stuggled night and day to get where we are and spent serveral hours Googling, looking through Reflector, and reading help files to figure out a small piece of functionallity; we're not about to give up that kind of 'can-do' attitude for some hand-outs at a pay site, and since I grew up dirt poor, whenever I see someone want to makes things exclusively available to those who can afford it; well that just drives me 10 times harder to best them - I hate stingy rich people.

When you start working from paycheck to paycheck, live in a middle class community in a smaller house, drive an older car with high milage, owe serveral thousands of dollars to serveral credit card companies making minimum payments then you can complain about how much money you are making because I know none of you at the top are - but before you do that, let me tell you about the crap hole I came from and how poor I was at that time of my life and some of the crap jobs I've worked just to put food on the table or the nights we had to use food stamps to have food on the table - then maybe, just maybe, you can complain to me about not getting the money you THINK you deserve - there are a lot of people in this world who give a hole lot more meaningful things to the world than software developers for a lot less (teachers for one, public servants such as cops or firefighters, members of our military) and actually do deserve more.

No one in our current industry is 'barely scratching out a living' at our pay rates - we have no right to complain. Having said that, I think those of you at the top SHOULD be paid well, and SHOULD be given compensation for your time and efforts donated to the community; you have earned it - but not like this - this isn't the spirit of our community. This isn't the right way, and frankly I disappointed to see this even surface and in some of the names on this post that are listed.
Thursday, July 20, 2006 3:19:11 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Brian,

The problem with starting down that road, is that you have no idea where any of us came from. If you want to compare "I came from nothing" stories I'll most likely match or exceed you in that history. I graduated from college in the Reagan-era recession and spent quite a long time doing data entry for temp agencies until I found a programming job that didn't pay enough to meet my bills. But I took it anyway, because I wanted to program.

So unless you've been stranded on the freeway while trying to get your paycheck to the bank so you could deposit it to have enough money to buy more gas so you could get to work the next morning, I think you need to chill out a bit...

And that isn't the point here anyway. Not to me.

And also please consider this: how many authors/speakers are having this dialog in public? Pretty much none. Why? Because it doesn't generate any love. So why am I doing it? Beats the hell out of me - it would be a LOT simpler to just shut my mouth and do what I need to do. But, like you, I believe in open dialog. I think (hope) there's something to be learned here - both by me and by others.

The world IS changing. Some parts of our industry are getting hit first (writing and speaking among them), but this change WILL impact everyone eventually. You might consider those of us who are getting hit now to be the canaries in the cage...

We live in a vaguely capitalistic society - that's the nature of the world economy. And if professional authors and speakers don't offer value worth buying, then so be it. Similarly, if US developers don't offer enough value over low-cost outsourcing suppliers, then so be it. We'll just all be out of work, and we'll need to find other work that DOES have value. Alternately we'll end up like the steel workers from the 80's...

But I sense you are in this for the passion, just like me. And so I doubt you'd be happy doing anything else, and so you'll fight tooth and nail to avoid having your job outsourced - because the end result is that you couldn't program (other than as a hobby) and you'd live out a sad and bitter life. I know that's my case...

(Have you ever played the "what else would I do" game? Where you try to figure out what you'd do if you weren't programming? I do it quite often, and I never have an answer. There isn't another job out there that I want to do, where I think I'd get the satisfaction I get from what I do today.)

So for me, at least, it is even harder. Because I _love_ the technology. And I _love_ writing and speaking. So I'll fight tooth and nail to find ways to maintain my standard of living, put my kids through college and still be able to write and speak about technology.

Perhaps Paul's experiment isn't the right approach. But my guess is that he'll do quite well selling to the "9 to 5" crowd or whatever. They outnumber the passion-based developers by a huge ratio, and they often have better access to corporate funds.

Personally, I plan to experiment along a different line. I like the book model, but don't like the cost and time structure. Can I really justify updating my books for .NET 3.0? Can I really justify asking everyone to spend another $60 just a year after the .NET 2.0 books came out?

I don't think so. I don't think that's fair at all. And yet I am doing a lot of work, and putting in a lot of time, around getting my content (CSLA .NET, sample app, etc.) up to speed for .NET 3.0. There's no way I can justify spending that much time and effort for free.

This is the quandary I'm in anyway. And there are many possible solutions - the question is which is best overall.

I need to at least match what I would have made from going down the book route (because I really could do a .NET 3.0 version of my books). On a per-hour basis that's laughable, so honestly I'd rather find a more lucrative approach.

I could also do some sort of subscription thing, where I close off part of my web site or blog to paid subscribers. But that doesn’t fit with my world view. The content on my web site is for support of the books and CSLA .NET. The content on my blog is my editorial space. And neither of them are “professional” content imo.

So what I’m considering doing is writing “chapters”, and hiring editors and reviewers to work with me to make the content professional. And then selling those chapters on a per-unit basis.

At present my thinking is that for .NET 3.0, I may come out with a 3 chapter “mini-book”. Very much along the lines of my existing books, but more like a sequel – focused on WPF/WCF/WF. At $5/chapter the consumer cost is the same as if I did this in true book form, but you don’t need to repurchase the 12 existing chapters that are largely unaffected by .NET 3.0.

Will this experiment work? Beats me. But I hope so, because the book alternative doesn’t sit well with me – and I think wouldn’t sit well with all the people who’ve bought the existing 2005 books. And the other alternative is to take CSLA .NET commercial, and I’m not real sure I want to do that either – not in small part because I really do believe in the idea of community.
Thursday, July 20, 2006 4:20:52 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Rocky,

I will agree that I might of let my passion get the best of me, and I sincerely hope that I did not offend you in the process. I have a lot or respect for you and your work, and recently with others are pushing very hard for you CSLA at our workplace. I have both the 1.1 and 2.0 version of your book and I would gladly pay $60 or even $80 for your next book in 3.0 because I think your material is worth the cost. And perhaps we my have similiar backgrounds and maybe that is the passion the drives us. Just when someone says they are tired of working with bad programmers and feel they should be paid in order to provide help to those who are not as good really eat me up inside.

I didn't mean to go down the road of 'sad' stories, I publically appoligize for that, but I really felt this heir of 'I want more money' from Paul's price rates, and perhaps that's the disadvantage of text dialogue, that set me down that road. Again I publically appologize, and your right, this is not the forum for that. Exclusive membership has always just been a sore spot with me and I am a passionate person, it has been greatest help and my greatest downfall many times and something that I am slowly learning to control, but obviously still need to work on. :)


Thursday, July 20, 2006 4:46:13 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
No offense taken Brian :) I fully understand getting passionate about ideas!
Thursday, July 20, 2006 5:42:34 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
One reasons that magazine subscription is dying because MSDN Visual Basic help was so incomplete. Earlier version of Visual Basic APIs were so incomplete, one could use all help in form of magazines, books and conferences. Now .Net CLR APIs are so encompassing and MSDN help so complete, I wonder whether one needs a book on ADO.net , Remoting, Winforms.etc.
Would I spend 1000$ yearly on books that shows how to use latest technologies from architectural perspective? Yes.
Would I subscribe to a 100 $ yearly Magazine’s Library Subscription which has articles how_to_create_a_Win_Form or how_to _connect_ to_a _database plus ask_the_experts section?

http://vikasnetdev.blogspot.com/2006/07/you-get-what-you-pay-for.html
Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:34:21 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Rocky, any chance of getting your readers a discount code? I see that Pauls registration form asks for one.
Friday, July 21, 2006 12:15:24 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Charging $5 for a "mini-book" sounds like the right approach.

I don't know how big the CSLA community is but, with literally MILLIONS of .NET programmers out there, at some point you should reach "critical mass." A $5 charge against even a few hundred thousand user-base isn't chum change.

Good luck on your quest.
Friday, July 21, 2006 9:25:24 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Maybe the solution (or part of it) is just micropayments. I have no idea how sites currently do (like TestDriven.NET) that has a paypal link and says, hey, if you like what I've done, just give me a buck. Getting a thousand people to give you a buck for an excellent tool doesn't get the kids through college, but it won't hurt either.

Maybe it's that books have been way overpriced for so long and there's been a backlash of it's-on-the-net-for-free that book sales (technical anyway) are tanking. But there HAS to be some kind of compensation for producing quality work. We all gotta eat :)
Monday, July 24, 2006 4:06:42 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Interesting discussion - and it's reminding me about another industry near and dear to my (and Jason's) heart - the music industry.

People are starting to get very comfortable receiving something of great value for free....
Dan Sniderman
Tuesday, July 25, 2006 3:18:50 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Rocky,

I like the core of this discussion... how is the IT world changing and what are some new ways to adapt to it and still earn a living. I did not like Paul's approach of selling his worth by his hourly rate, or defining the inner circle advisers by their's {I'm with PS, definitely came across elitist}. I find great value from your books, website and blogs, and the value to me wouldn't change if you made $50 an hour or $250 on hour. Hourly rates are often a combination of IT Consultant company marketing slickness and client gullibility... i.e. just a bit of arbitrary decision making there, IMO. I think this discussion concentrates on how "we the IT labor" can improve ourselves and make ourselves more valuable to employers... and for sure, there is an obvious need to become more efficient at obtaining those core development learning curve needs out of the vast information wilderness. That said, let me throw out a couple of observations... granted a bit pessimistic.

1) I think, whatever the models, IT labor will continue to figure out ways to be accumulate required software development knowledge. I'm not worried about us... I am worried about

2) Client knowledge level. The hiring party to this relationship still writes the checks. I sure hope there are as many dedicated folks serving that need as well as you serve the .NET developer need. I have my doubts... my guess is given the added complexity of the current development world leaves them a bit overwhelmed. My guess is that is the real void... not the labor side.

3) Outsourcing. I'm glad you think we can overcome the 4-7 ratios. I think in the long run, that will be impossible. The trend seems to be big companies getting bigger... and big corporations using big consulting companies with the fiber optic pipeline to India or China. Perhaps coding is just another form of manufacturing that is on it's move out of the US and we are just swimming upstream. Perhaps your book audience is China and India {much bigger market}, but your code US code slinging is truly destined to be a hobby. What exactly in software development {perhaps other than security reasons} couldn't be outsourced to cheaper labor in the age of fiber optics and video conferencing? I often hear that "at least the analysis has to happen here"? Why? You could have user's spend their required weekly hours telling the IT folks about their business requirements in front of the video cam... just as well as sitting in a room in person. Well, maybe not quite as good as with a white board, but if their boss says they like the 50% reductions in IT costs, I think that user will be sitting in front of the video cam.

... I would be very pleased to hear anyone here make the case why I'm all wet on #3.



Mike
Wednesday, July 26, 2006 8:44:16 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Yes, as I've said before, I think we are the canaries in the cage, and others will feel these same effects. Probably not everyone, but we can already see it affecting accounting, tax prep and even some financial analyst jobs. Any job that is primarily information-based is in trouble.

And to Dan's point, music is certainly another - and TV might follow as well.

The economists tell us that as these "expendable" jobs move away from us, that we'll all be able to find other jobs that can't move. But the only jobs that can't move are non-information-based. Things like construction, flipping burgers, road work, etc.

Even management or executives aren't really safe. Both these roles are almost entirely information-based, and so in the long run it would be a lot more cost-effective for shareholders to have a CEO that makes 15% of a US CEO. Of course the REAL rules at that level are entirely different - having more to do with buddy networks than with economics - so the idea of an outsourced CEO is probably just a dream... :)

My point is that the idea of all the information-related jobs moving away is not fun - because it means that the thing for which many of us have ultimate passion would not be a viable job.

I don’t think this is quite like the steelworkers from a few decades ago. OK, I’m sure a few steelworkers had passion for steel, but I’m equally sure that the vast majority got into that work because it was just work with a good paycheck. When steelwork collapsed the problem wasn’t that people LOVED their work, it was that they loved where they lived. They didn’t want to physically move, and so you had all those depressed towns.

But for us it really is that we LOVE the work. That we can’t imagine wanting to do anything else. That if we can’t program computers, we’d have to live like the rest of humanity – holding some job for the money it makes, and actually _living_ only when we’re not at work. Many of my friends are in this situation – working at day jobs (even good, well-paying ones), but doing so only because you gotta have a job to survive. Their _real_ life starts when work stops.

Now I fully realize that we, today, are the anomaly. That the idea of your job and hobby being one and the same has always been extremely rare. But this doesn’t mean that we should quietly give up this life, only to fade into the slow soul-death that is the normal workplace.

Nor do I think Mike’s #3 is a done deal. For a couple reasons.

First, though the interim is painful, the fact is that there’s an equalizing effect in terms of costs. India is slowly getting more expensive, and China will follow. In “The Lexus and the Olive Tree’, Friedman discusses this effect – how globalization will help the poorer countries of the world. What he refuses to acknowledge (but which I believe) is that, at least in the short term, this will depress and harm the US and Europe.

But the point is that people won’t work for cheap forever. You can see it today, as Indian workers scramble to get physically to the US – because they _know_ they are being exploited in India. They’ll accept that for a while, because it is better than what they had before, but I find it hard to believe they’ll accept the exploitation long-term.

Second, and more importantly, our industry has suffered from a serious stagnation in terms of innovation over the past couple decades, or at least 15 years. I’ve talked about this elsewhere (such as my recent css blog post); every time we get productive with a set of technology, we abandon it in favor of something where a text editor is the best tool available. What’s with that?!?

As soon as VB/Powerbuilder/Delphi got _really_ productive, we invented the web and started programming in notepad. We did this rather than tackling the one remaining issue facing client/server: deployment. Was this a net gain? What would life look like if we’d just solved the deployment issues for VB/Powerbuilder apps and kept that productivity?

ASP.NET 2.0 is close to VB3 levels of productivity. So after about 10 years of work, the web has us back to where we were in 1993. And this is progress?

Worse, the web is undergoing yet another revolution – css, AJAX and soon WPF/e. And don’t even get me started on WPF, because it is yet another example of “starting over with notepad”…

The point being that NONE of these “innovations” in the UI space, and nothing about RMI, Remoting or WCF, offer any productivity benefits. Oh sure, they are neat in their own ways, but they don’t offer even a multiplier effect in terms of productivity, much less an order of magnitude…

And that’s what we need – ideally an order of magnitude productivity gain.

Because the fact is that we _do_ have something to offer by being local vs remote. My brother runs a dev team that exists in the US, France, India and Japan. They do 24 hour development. And the overhead costs are HUGE, because the team is never awake at the same times, except for bi-monthly conference calls that rotate across the 24 hour clock so everyone has to be awake at 3 AM for a meeting a couple times a year (everyone gets screwed equally).

If we cut development costs by an order of magnitude (10x or more), then the decision process changes (from the business perspective). By being local, we offer the service of being in the same timezone, the same culture, speaking the same language – including body language as well as voice.

You can’t discount those last two. My brother has some amazing stories about culture differences, and how managing the Indian team is entirely different from managing the Japanese team. To ask each group to do work requires different sentence structures that match their cultural expectations. And of course both are different from what you’d find in the US. He lost over a month’s time by asking the Japanese team to do work by using US phrasing, and they nodded and said “yes”. But it turns out they were saying “yes I heard you”, not “yes we’ll do it”, and so they did no work…

My point is that there is _tremendous_ benefit to the business if local people do the work. But only if the overall cost is close.

The counter-argument here is that if we build tools that give a 10x productivity boost, that just makes outsourcing _more_ attractive. But that’s not true.

I think it is just like distributed computing. There’s an overhead cost to making a cross-network call, then there’s the work cost of actually doing the desired task. If you send two numbers over the network to be added, the overhead cost is WAY higher than the work cost, and so going across the network is silly. But in other cases the work cost is higher than the overhead, and so distributing the work makes sense.

The same is true here. If the work cost can become cheap enough, then the overhead cost of using remote resources will outweigh the work cost. At that point it becomes more cost effective to use a local (if more expensive) resource and avoid the overhead.

So I really do think there’s an answer, even in the near-term. And that is to achieve a productivity gain that is at least an order of magnitude.

Unfortunately it is _very_ clear that this isn’t coming from major vendors. Microsoft is building new technologies to do the same stuff we already do. And they are nice technologies, but there’s no order of magnitude in them (except maybe with software factories, DSLs and related concepts). IBM is all Java-happy – and there’s no order of magnitude to be found anywhere in the Java world either… Maybe Ruby on Rails is going the right direction, but I don’t know enough about it to say for sure.

Oh, and then there’s SOA – but that’s another one of those “back to notepad” technologies, so it doesn’t help – and probably hurts…

Not that getting this kind of productivity boost is easy. But it is necessary, and is (I think) the only way we (in the US/Europe) are going to be able to continue to do what we love.
Wednesday, July 26, 2006 10:20:08 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Rocky,

I've had Friedman's new book "The World is Flat" collecting dust for a long time now. I read the first chapter and then got sidetracked. It occurs to me I might want to read his prior book “The Lexus and the Olive Tree" first. I'm a huge fan of Friedman, and read his Op-Eds online religiously until they started charging {guess that might be another example of not being willing to pay for information on the web}.

I could point you to some of my recent blogs/rants on the subject of outsourcing, and you would find the use of the word "canary" and almost the exact same quote that CEOs could be outsourced also using the same labor cost saving arguments. Great minds think alike. :) I think a current college student these days would be nuts not to ask the question "can this career be outsourced, or does this type of work have to be physically done in person". A friend's son is studying to be a Chiropractor. Good choice... can't pipe that over the fiber optics.

I wish I was as optimistic as you that there are factors that will work in our domestic IT favor. You make some gallant arguments, and I liked hearing them. Unfortunately, I come to another conclusion... both short term and long term. I hope you are right, and I'm all wet. Short term, I would say the first-sheep-move is in effect. In Capitalism, you have to match your competition. The first rental car corporation (Thrifty headquartered in Tulsa) that replaces it's IT staff with EDS which staffs primarily with Indian IT labor from the Indian Silicon Valley) forces the hand of every rental car corporation. They have to match labor costs in order to match rental rates. I think stopping the sheep move would be like trying to stop water from running downhill... without US government action in the interim. Although you won't find a bigger fan of globalization and it's potential to raise {long overdue} the standards of living around the globe than me, I do differ with Freidman in one area. He believes that the US middle class has to absorb what's coming purely dictated by the free hand of the market without government interference... i.e. government will only cause harm. He loses me here, because I think our government could play a productive role in streching the inevitable middle class pain {maybe devestation} over a decade or two, rather than a couple of years. Globalization is inevitable... but the timeframe is not. I'm convinced we are in the middle of something completely new that previous thories of Comparative Advantage don't hold up. We are talking about something completely new with corporations outsourcing labor costs to distressed labor markets, just to turn around and sell back to the same domestic market. I've heard some interesting debates on the subjects from economists... needless to say you can find an economist to take both sides. One of the best debates I heard was one at a Brookings Institute conference... probably a year ago (on C-SPAN). An economist from The Heritage Foundation addressed one of your arguments... "that labor rates tend to even out over time across countries/markets". His response was that's true, but run the numbers on highly college educated Chinese and Indians. You are looking at 20+ years to run through those type of numbers.

I'm not an economists, but I don't get how you gut middle class information jobs and expect all of us to find the next better job... i.e. creative destruction. When IT and certain types of Engineering become the old low end jobs... practically overnight... I think you might just have a problem in the economy. I well aware of the growing wealth gap in our bifurcated economy, but doens't the upper end need consumers. Maybe they can replace the domestic consumers with foreign consumers... and bifurcation land continues to work for the top. Doesn't sound like a good place to live... even if you are at your counry club.

I'm been living this canary thing for four years. It has amazed me how fast an industry that I have been a part of for over 20 years can change this fast. I've gone from being a lifetime Republican to a Democrat during my canary years... and IT Unions now make sense to me. How sad is that... the actions of CEOs and our eat-your-own-kill version of Capitalism has lead me to even mentioning IT Unions in 2006 USA. Sad indeed. The only change that may save our careers may very well be organized labor and government involvement in the free market. Get Paul to start that one... more chance to save us than smart IT people thinking it's their fault because they haven't learned enough.




Mike
Wednesday, July 26, 2006 12:26:38 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Rocky,

"Even management or executives aren't really safe. Both these roles are almost entirely information-based, and so in the long run it would be a lot more cost-effective for shareholders to have a CEO that makes 15% of a US CEO. Of course the REAL rules at that level are entirely different - having more to do with buddy networks than with economics - so the idea of an outsourced CEO is probably just a dream... :)"

Yep... nothing like a CEO outsourcing feeding frenzy to focus the mind on how much power we cede to CEOs in our country. Whether you think that is the way it should be or not, if one is being personably responsible providing a living for their families in corporate environments, you have to now read the CEO tea leaves. CEOs literally have the power to elimate the entire IT shop which includes 20 year loyal employees with outsourced IT labor... and collect a nice bonus for the cost savings. As I sit down to work through the CSLA 2.0 sample applications in order to maybe be inner circle worthy someday, the thought keeps entering my mind: "haven't I seen enough warnings to know it's time for a new career". You are likely incur financial harm by postponing the required career change. And again, your comments and my recent blogs overlap when you say:

"(Have you ever played the "what else would I do" game? Where you try to figure out what you'd do if you weren't programming? I do it quite often, and I never have an answer. There isn't another job out there that I want to do, where I think I'd get the satisfaction I get from what I do today.)"

Regardless of "the love of IT", if you have spent 20+ years at something and are told one day... "that's over, pick what's next", you will be in a very narrow minority if you have a quick answer for that challenge. It would be one thing if you spent 20 years in the horse and buggy business, and then it went away. I have just a little problem with "it's going away because the CEOs want to save some IT budget... so they can up their executive compensations from 400 times average worker pay to 500 times". Maybe I'm just the angry type and not honoring the just rewards/harvest of the average executive compensation package. My red state friends tell me it's just an envy problem. Either way, things are definitely CHANGING. In the past, a 4 year college bet was likely to provide for a career. If you are in college today and majoring in anything where your employement is likely to be corporations, wouldn't you like a heads-up from CEO-land what jobs and careers are future outsourcing candidates. Even for folks caught in this mid-career... if your career change plan includes more years of college... don't you need the same heads-up from the CEOs with the power in the modern age to eliminate domestic careers... or if not eliminate, with a stroke of the outsourcing pen divide the available jobs in half. Jobs are a numbers game... the economy only needs so many accountants, programmers, lawyers, etc. If the entire IT industry went back and retrained as accountants, it wouldn't create the need for more accountants. You really do have to ask the question... how do the job numbers and folks mapped to them work out in the US in the age of outsourcing? For sure, those $200 an hour rates aren't likely to hold up. But hey... we live in interesting times. Grab the popcorn... it's shaping up to one hell of a movie. I doubt the outsourcing numbers are very large yet, but then isn't it one of those a-little-bit-pregnant things.

Rocky, you wanted "open" discussion. Was that too open?



Mike
Wednesday, July 26, 2006 3:24:24 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Hi All,

Thanks for all the great feedback on my Inner Circle. I have posted a comment on my blog that I think will summarize my feelings on this new site and the intent. Please check it out http://weblogs.asp.net/psheriff/archive/2006/07/26/Paul-Sheriff_2700_s-Inner-Circle-Comments.aspx
Tuesday, August 01, 2006 7:44:20 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Here's the item in the discussion that hit home for me. Rocky said:

"Second, and more importantly, our industry has suffered from a serious stagnation in terms of innovation over the past couple decades, or at least 15 years. I’ve talked about this elsewhere (such as my recent css blog post); every time we get productive with a set of technology, we abandon it in favor of something where a text editor is the best tool available. What’s with that?!?

As soon as VB/Powerbuilder/Delphi got _really_ productive, we invented the web and started programming in notepad. We did this rather than tackling the one remaining issue facing client/server: deployment. Was this a net gain? What would life look like if we’d just solved the deployment issues for VB/Powerbuilder apps and kept that productivity?

ASP.NET 2.0 is close to VB3 levels of productivity. So after about 10 years of work, the web has us back to where we were in 1993. And this is progress? ...

So I really do think there’s an answer, even in the near-term. And that is to achieve a productivity gain that is at least an order of magnitude.

Unfortunately it is _very_ clear that this isn’t coming from major vendors. Microsoft is building new technologies to do the same stuff we already do. And they are nice technologies, but there’s no order of magnitude in them (except maybe with software factories, DSLs and related concepts). IBM is all Java-happy – and there’s no order of magnitude to be found anywhere in the Java world either… "

Well said, Rocky!

The major vendors have absolutely NO interest in making the technology better. They just rehash old code and ideas and then stuff it in a shiny new box. I am so sick and tired of creating the "same" application over and over. Sure, each application is based on "new" technology - but none of it is really new. Maybe I'm just burned out. No - that's not it. I'm BORED!

I have solved my boredom by working with a product that _does_ solve the problem of client/server deployment. I'll not mention it's name here because I don't what this to seem like an advertisement. The point is, there are products out there that can "spark" the fire and passion we used to have (those of us that have been doing this 15+ years know what I'm talking about). The problem with these products is actually finding a client that is willing to pay to use them. They aren't mainstream, so clients believe that getting support or finding someone to maintain their apps will be difficult.

Of course, there is some validity to these concerns. The major vendors have a lock on the industry that is hard to break through. What is likely to happen is what always happens. The big companies notice a better product offered from a "competitor," then buy the competition and either remove the product from the market place or stuff it into one of there products as an add-on; bastardizing beyond recognition in the process.

Is there an answer to this problem? I think so, but involves some luck. The owners of the "competition" have to love their job and/or product so much that they're unwilling to sell out to the big boys. Then, of course, the big boys have to just let it go. Meaning that they don't create a similar product and begin direct competition with the smaller company. What are the chances of that happening? Like I said, we need some luck...
Monday, August 07, 2006 10:40:39 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
There apparently was not an appetite for a discussion about knowledge work outsourcing... but I thought I would drop a book recommendation for anyone in our profession.

The World is Flat - Thomas Friedman

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0374292795/sr=8-1/qid=1154967121/ref=pd_bbs_1/104-8536181-7848720?ie=UTF8

Disclaimer: I'm a huge Thomas Friedman fan, so I am biased in trusting his views. Also, I have around another 100 pages left to read.

The subject of his book is spot-on for Rocky's title "adapting to a new world". Friedman deals with the brave new "Flat world" facilitated by the internet, fiber across the ocean floors (btw... I was one of those suckers (stock holders) who helped fund Winnick's Global Crossing), collaboration software and masses of cheap highly-educated FUNGIBLE knowledge worker labor. Most of us have some idea of what is going on... but Friedman fills in the detail. Interestingly, Friedman comes to the conclusion that US knowledge workers will do well by moving to HORIZONTAL (wish I had that list) knowledge worker jobs that will spring up from free trade with India and China and the increased consumer market that represents. I'm not as optimistic... run the numbers of the new highly educated global knowledge worker pool, and try and envision that we will compete well in the long run selling products to the Chinese market that they will not provide for themselves (in the long run). Regardless, I drop this book recommendation for anyone in our profession.

For a less optimistic view that all of this "just all works out":

http://www.globalexchange.org/campaigns/ftaa/1376.html


Anyone have any guesses what those new HORIZONTAL IT jobs will be? If the typical code-slinging becomes the fungible jobs that move to cheaper labor... what's our new horizonatal niches? I guess that is a trick question... nobody ever knows in advance (for the most part) what new jobs will be created by economies.



Mike
Monday, August 07, 2006 11:18:31 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Yes, I'm also a Thomas Friedman reader (I don't know if I'll say fan). I find his analysis thoughtful and easy to read. But I think he is overly optimistic, portraying the rise of the non-US economies as only a positive for the US worker...

I do think globalization will, in the long run, have a net positive effect on the economies of the world. But it is not at all clear to me that there will be a positive effect for US (or many European) people. Sure, the CEO types will rake in the cash, but nearly everyone beneath them is likely to be hurt by this shift in economic reality.

The industrial revolution is often held up as an example of where old jobs were destroyed, but the net result was positive - even for those who were displaced. The same is held for the information revolution, where industrial jobs were lost, but retraining allowed people to move to information work.

And that may all be true, but there's a key difference now. In both these previous revolutions, the job opportunities remained within a given geographic area. That area was local (for farming) and became somewhat regional (for industry). It then became national (for information). And now this new revolution (whatever it is called) expands the boundary to the global level.

So a farmer could send their kids to work in sweat shops in a city. The sweat shop worker could send their kids to work in a cube in a skyscraper. But it is far from clear where the kids of the cube workers will go...

The thing is, when the changes remain (relatively) localized, the new type of jobs help fuel the economy - in a way that affects normal people. Factory workers supported their farm-based predecessors. Info workers supported their industrial predecessors. All of them supported the surrounding retail and service workers.

But when the jobs move to another country, none of these side-effects occur. The offshore workers don't support the previous "generation" in the US. And neither they, nor the previous "generation" supports the retail or service workers in the US. So the end result, as I see it, is that wealth flows out of the US without any positive influence for most of us.

An economist would disagree. They'd point out that a lot of wealth DOES flow back into the US. Companies make more money with cheaper labor. But I am not a company, nor are most of you reading this. So what do we gain? Well, I imagine that if we start doing yard work for CEOs we'll do OK, or if you are in retail or a service job in close proximity to a number of CEOs you'll do OK. But if only the CEOs make money off this inbound flow of wealth then we have a problem...

And yet I remain optimistic. I guess primarily because I buy into the theory that the core of being an American is to adapt. To fight through difficulty, and to make necessary changes to win. These changes aren't always pleasant - look at the Oregon Trail, or the civil rights movements - but we've always had the will to take the hard road when necessary.

The hard road for our industry might actually be to adopt software factories. To adopt true productivity advances. To give up the micro-management of C# and VB and Java in favor of higher level abstractions.

The "horizontal" work, in my view, is work that requires good communication skill, good undestanding of local cultural realities.

The true COST of software is overhead. And that overhead is primarily design, development and testing. The analysis is not overhead - that is pure business, and it requires high levels of interactivity which have proven very hard to do remotely.

But think about a world in which you don't design software - the design is pre-determined by your tools. You don't really develop (as we understand it today), as much as assembly higher level "blocks" together to accomplish the goal. Was there multithreading? N-tier? Who cares. Worrying about that is overhead and will cost you your job. Unit testing is a thing of the past, because the units are pre-built. You just do integration testing to ensure the flow of your blocks are correct and away you go.

I'm not sure I like that future. But I can honestly say I like it a lot better than I like the idea of changing careers to work in construction, or becoming some CEOs lawn care specialist so he can pay me with all the money he made by sending my job overseas...
Monday, August 07, 2006 2:07:47 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Rocky,

Isn't Friedman from your neck of the woods... Minneapolis?

"But it is far from clear where the kids of the cube workers will go..."

China. Seriously... it's as good a bet as any that instead of foreign students coming here for college and careers, the trend is reversed. All countries go through economic lifecycles (I liked Kevin Phillip's "Wealth and Democracy" on the subject)... including the US. My guess is job migration across the borders gets a steroid boost going forward.

"An economist would disagree."

No... even the economists are having a robust argument these days over Ricardo's "comparative advantage" theories that have been the gospel. The Schumer article I linked above explained the debate going on... i.e. factors of production being exported to cheaper labor, but turning around and selling back to the same market". However it works out... this is a new twist. Friedman comes out on the side that Ricardo's comparative advantage theories hold up just as well for outsourced labor and services as it does for the trade of products... but he glosses over the REAL debate going on among economists. Paul Craig Roberts (http://www.washingtontimes.com/commentary/20050423-104818-2947r.htm) seems to write very thought-provoking arguments against the faith-based acceptance of outsourcing... but many conservatives attack him like a heretic. Hey... economists go at each other just as much as IT guys go at each other. :)

"They'd point out that a lot of wealth DOES flow back into the US. Companies make more money with cheaper labor. But I am not a company, nor are most of you reading this. So what do we gain?"

I think what we gain is a bifurcated economy... i.e. a continued widening of the US wealth gap. I think it's one of the reason that public perception of our economy doesn't match the GDP numbers that are paraded out as proof everything is hitting on all cylinders in the US economy. Yes, the aggregate GDP is probably growing... but the distribution within those numbers matter greatly. If 50% of the US population can buy a Lexus, Lexus has a huge US market. If you have the same GDP, but only 5% of the market can afford the Lexus (the 5% doesn't need a bunch of Lexus vehicles), you have an entirely different market. I'm no economist, but common sense dictates a flatter income distribution with MORE doing well creates a more robust market than equal GDP with a vary narrow concentration of wealth.

"The hard road for our industry might actually be to adopt software factories."

I would be interested in what you mean here. I certainly have agreed with your posts that software development in 2006 should have advanced well beyond "doing the same thing now... just with different languages and platform".

"The analysis is not overhead - that is pure business, and it requires high levels of interactivity which have proven very hard to do remotely."

I actually have my doubts that it will remain hard to do remotely. You listen to Friedman describe the video conference room in the Bangalore "Silicon Valley"... where they have several markets/countries/companies all sitting there having a meeting... and you think "if there is $ involved, people will find a way". Besides, if all that is left on the US side is analyst work... jeeze!!! :)

"But think about a world in which you don't design software - the design is pre-determined by your tools. You don't really develop (as we understand it today), as much as assembly higher level "blocks" together to accomplish the goal. Was there multithreading? N-tier? Who cares. Worrying about that is overhead and will cost you your job. Unit testing is a thing of the past, because the units are pre-built. You just do integration testing to ensure the flow of your blocks are correct and away you go."

Absolutely... but I question if any of this could ever be a US competitive advantage to combat cheaper labor. What exactly in our business doesn't become globally available? If it's Windows OS... it's sold all over the globe. If it's CSLA, anyone has access to it. It's a global standard-driven IT world... proprietary nation software (or advantage) seems a bit of an oxymoron.

This is the bottom line for me... and it goes back to your comment about outsourcing a CEO. If the planets (or at least this rock and it's fiber optic connected countries) have aligned primed and ready to serve up knowledge work (I never knew that is what my programming was... thought I was just slinging code) to the CHEAPEST labor.... somebody better define where that exporting line ends. What role does a CEO play other than a "knowledge role". If this is all economics, then you have to create an artificial barrier (non-economic) to explain why our million dollar CEO pay packages aren't outsourced to some cream-of-the-IQ-genepool-Chinese dude willing to work for 1/10th (I think your 4:7 ratio may be a bit optimistic). I've sat at several major US companies never seeing the CEO... didn't seem like he was around the cubicle helping out. I guess my point is I want to hear someone define that boundary in economic terms. Even if you got to the best global free trade resistance-free definition... you now have to muddy the waters with security questions. Tell me when you (anyone) reaches their US outsourcing security threshold 1) Foreigner owning a lot of our business (don't lose too many here, we are have that world and it seems to be working 2) all our manufacturing done overseas (we had crying by those outsourced along the way, but they were a small enough minority, and we seem to be still functioning) 3) outsourcing of IT, Engineering, Accounting to other countries... is this the same security risk of not manufacturing anything... now we don't manufacture or develop and maintain our own business applications 4) outsourcing government software (Defense Department, CIA, etc)... oops, now we lost a lot of folks, but why would US college kids ever study IT if only 1% would be PROTECTED jobs in the US 5) Company CEOs... is it a security risk if we didn't pay Michael Eisner $50 million a year for Disney... could we possibly trust Disney to an outsourced CEO?

One last Friedman observation... which I have been seeing on a smaller scale. I'm one of those guys (go ahead, call me a conspiracy theorist) who thinks corporate interest already owns our government. According to Friedman, I probably haven't seen anything yet. Imagine a time where global corporations are more powerful than any government... i.e. as economic interests become more interwined, your nation's democracy has less to say about your domestic social policy than the global power brokers... i.e. every nation's economic life depends on the beast. Yep... interesting times indeed. But hey, if every part of the globe represented a market, war may be a thing of the past becuse you know the profit motive wouldn't stand for a lost market. :)

Mike
Thursday, October 26, 2006 6:17:20 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
What a fascinating discussion. The passion overfloweth. It will be very interesting to see how Paul's "experiment" shakes out. I wish him the best, but then we've been friends for most of those 20 years he talks about.

The Inner Circle probably does sound elitist, particularly to fans of the open source movement and their somewhat socialist viewpoint. But realistically, the Inner Circle concept and the sales copy that promotes it are all about marketing an information product. If you find it distasteful, that simply means you aren't a potential customer. LOTS of other people find it exciting. You can berate those people as 9-to-5-ers if you want. Even if that is the demographic (which I doubt), isn't it a little elitist to shame them for wanting to have a life outside of software development? I'll bet their families appreciate their sense of priority.

I'm not surprised that many hard-core developers are turned off by the seeming hype. Marketing is anathema to them. The attitude that valid business models are distasteful is part of what brought about the first bubble. I believe we are heading for another one now with the extreme hype and low substance behind "Web 2.0". True technologists are rarely good business people, and dealing with that issue is one of the inspirations behind the Inner Circle.

As a developer, you have choices. Code without monetary compensation in mind (e.g. as a hobby or open source programmer), figure out a way to keep your skills economically reasonable to potential employers or customers (in an ever-changing business and technical environment), or get something else to do.
Comments are closed.