Thursday, September 11, 2008
« Funny Microsoft commercial | Main | CSLA .NET 3.6 (Silverlight and Windows) ... »
CSLA .NET 3.6+ in VB - a community effort?

A few weeks ago I posted what was basically a request for input on one aspect of the future of CSLA .NET. I got a lot of really thoughtful and useful feedback and input from that post (and a related thread in the forum). I've also been discussing this with Apress and other colleagues, and I've come to a decision.

Starting with version 3.6, CSLA .NET for Windows and CSLA .NET for Silverlight will be maintained in C# only. This will allow me to focus more of my energies on improving the framework, and on providing resources and materials on how to use the framework (in both C# and VB).

In the short term this means continuing to finalize version 3.6 and to finish Expert C# 2008 Business Objects (current availability target is December).

However, I am willing to take some people up on their offer to help maintain the VB version of the framework, if those offers still stand. The idea would be to have the community keep the VB code base in sync with the C# code base as it evolves - at least for CSLA .NET for Windows.

And here's a possible incentive. If the VB code can be brought up to sync by mid-December or so, I will work with Apress to create Expert VB 2008 Business Objects following the C# edition of the book. I really can't do that book in VB unless the framework exists in VB, but if that can happen then I'm pretty sure we can make the book happen shortly thereafter.

Contributors will need to sign a contributor agreement, to keep everything clear and legal. And they'll use the current subversion repository and issue tracking database, so I think it should be a pretty smooth arrangement. And obviously contributors will have the undying gratitude of the community :)

If you are interested in making this happen, please email me - rocky (at) lhotka dot net - and we'll go from there.

I think this should be a good overall solution, hopefully making everyone happy in both the short and long term.

Books | CSLA .NET
Thursday, September 11, 2008 3:56:23 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)  #    Disclaimer  |  Comments [7]  |  Related posts:
WP7 upgrade notes
CSLA 4 version 4.0.1 released
CSLA 4 WP7 progress update 2
CSLA .NET and MVVM video series
Getting CSLA 4 to compile for WP7
MSDN Bytes interview on WP7

Thursday, September 11, 2008 6:05:35 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I think you've found a good balance with your decision.
Really looking forward to some "how to" books coming through the pipeline (more than I'm looking forward to Expert 2008) :)
Paul
Friday, September 12, 2008 11:09:04 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Rocky,

You really need to learn how to say NO.

Although I understand and appreciate your willingness to make everyone happy, it’s really not in your best interest nor in the best interest of the majority of the CSLA community for you to spend any time supporting a book on VB.

Even if the community worked on the VB version of the framework, I bet you money you will most likely end up spending a significant amount of your time dealing with the VB stuff. Why, why, why??? You have better things to do. Spend your valuable time doing things that are significant.

Perhaps if the framework was also supported on a language such as F# then perhaps I would see something productive coming out having the framework on two languages, but supporting another language (VB) that is basically the same thing as C# but with different syntax is ridiculous and a complete waste of your time if you ask me.

My advice is for you just to say NO.
Rene
Friday, September 12, 2008 11:25:57 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Dear Rocky,

I'm very thankful for CSLA, but I pretty much agree with Rene. Also, I'm sure that a community driven VB translation will most probably fall behind the C# version quickly whithout adding real value.

I'm just starting to move from VB to C# and to anybody in the same position I can only recommend to get ReSharper - it makes me actually enjoy the process!

Hendrik
Friday, September 12, 2008 11:37:53 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I appreciate the comments, but I do think you underestimate the size and enthusiasm of the VB community.

In any case, I'm not necessarily saying that I will do the book port to VB myself. Assuming the VB framework exists, porting the book is a _very_ mechanical process that can be done by a semi-technical person, and either I or Apress would likely hire such a person to do the work.

I've done these a few times now, and I can say with some authority that the process is a mechanical, multi-step effort involving replacing code snippets, some figures, and meticulously going through the prose to change keywords (like internal to Friend). Not stimulating, not overly fun, and something than can be farmed out.

So I see no downside to doing this - only a lot of happy VB developers.
Rockford Lhotka
Monday, September 15, 2008 9:11:12 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Rocky -

In all due respect, your comment about "underestimate the size and enthusiasm of the VB community" - seems to fly in contradiction to what you've written here about the number of C# developers and demand in general overshadowing the VB.NET demand. This point is of course brought home in simple Dice.com searches for major metro areas. VB.NET just seems to be falling out of favor (demand) very very quickly in comparison to C#. So I'm not sure why you feel compelled then to continue on supporting VB.NET. I'd love to know where then all these VB.NET devs and jobs/demand are??

Just my $.02...
Leigh
Sunday, September 21, 2008 12:54:48 AM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Leigh - Where are we? We're existing VB6 developers that have remained in our current positions and simply picked up VB.NET... I think that's one of the reasons there isn't a huge demand for Vb.NET developers - yet. But it's coming, there's a number of VB6 legacy apps out there that are going to need to be converted and a lot of those shops are going to continue with VB when moving to .NET.

Personally, maintaining CSLA in C# only seems to make sense to me - and that comes from some one who has been doing VB in its various forms for the last 15 years. I just came from a shop that is using a customized version of CSLA - the C# version no less. It's the only part of the application written in C#, the resit is in VB.NET. That's part of the beauty of .NET, is the cross-language portability. Even still, a How-To targeting both C# and VB.NET developers would be a great addition.

C. Anderson
Sunday, October 19, 2008 6:25:26 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Hi Rocky,

I'm really really excited and looking forward for the 3.6.

But I'm quite saddened by the fact that you seem to favor c# nowadays instead of VB. I have always prefered VB over c# and I have always thought that you'd prefer VB over c# too. As you may notice I'm a big VB fan. And from the looks of things seems like the c# version will get to be released first.

A quick question though, do you really prefer c# over vb? and why?


Thanks,

Joseph
Joseph
Comments are closed.